Rear shoulder belt anchor point

[californiabristol]

I am trying to reposition the shoulder belt anchor point on the rear belts of my 411. Currently, the re-tractors are located above the fuel tank directly
behind the rear seat positions( i.e. on the parcel shelf). I want to move
the re-tractors outboard so the belt does not fall directly on the neck.

Can anyone tell me if the rear wheel well is a better location to mount the re-tractor? This would be a simple solution provided the wheel well is not
rusted!

Greg Woog

[irienz]

The upper end of the front seatbelts in my 411 are mounted at the top of the rear inner guards. Several years ago the mountings were discovered to be badly corroded and the restorer reported that he had been able to pull belt mount out of the guard easily by hand so watchfulness of structural integrity is certainly essential!

I fitted lap belts only in the rear of the 411 because of the lack of a proper upper mount, the inner rear guard already bearing the front upper mount. I obtained an engineer's report that the 411 lacked anything sufficiently structural for a mounting in order to obtain an exemption from the usual three-point belt requirement in New Zealand when it was imported here. I would not have thought that the rear parcel shelf was an adequate mounting surface.

Chris Browne

[californiabristol]

Chris,

Thank you for your reply. I purchased my car in England, and as it had
a current MOT, I assumed that the seat belt mountings met some
sort of regulation. The front shoulder belt upper guides in my 411
are mounted to the top of the B-post( re-tractors fixed to the B post base).
The rear shoulder belt retractors are mounted on bars spanning the sheet
metal below the rear screen and the bulkhead in front of the fuel tank.
It sounds like moving the retractors to reinforced locations atop the
rear wheel wells should be safer.

Greg Woog

[Kevin H]

Greg,

That doesn't look very secure.

This is how they are mounted on my 411, which I believe is original.

I will see if I can find some better photos.

Regards,
Kevin

[lansdownplace]

Greg, I would be very careful with this. There is no existing structure for the top anchor on the 411 capable of supporting the forces experienced in a full on crash. Rear belts weren't required or even dreamt of back then Bristol only provided a structure for them when it built the 603 series cars. You have to weld in a support from the chassis. Bristol themselves won't fit three points in the rear unless they are putting in the extra superstructure as they have liability if it goes wrong.

Many cars have the anchors fixed to the parcel shelf alone, which is OK provided you accept that a big shunt with an adult in the back risks failure big time. Whilst Bristol won't put one in, there are lots of owners and back-streeters who will so there is a risk that the rear belts on any 411 are dangerous. For any 411 owners out there who aren't sure of the provenance of your rear belts, I would check them out. They are the kind of item that is only stress checked on first and last use.

Lap belts are safer from the point of view that they can be anchored to the chassis and are a cheaper fix, if a bit messy and not so good in a crash

Paul

[bkz411]

My 411 Series 6 which is a nut and bolt restoration of a Series 4. It has,
what I would call, 'normal' seat belts in the back. I use them daily for my
kids, who both use child seats as well.

I am not technical when it comes to cars - but if you would like I can take
a picture of them if that would help shed more light on what is possible?
Let me know if this would help.

John